Game of this type - Difficulties
Sitemap 'Game of This Type Difficulties - For the Needed Game Engine' : * See Also Griefers * See Also Playing_To_Ignorance * See Also Pop-a-Mole Mentalities * See Also Politically_Correct_Targets_Of_Player_Mass_Murder Difficulties of running a more complex game on the computers (the interfaces, the way the game is presented/accessed by the Player, how the client and server(s) operate)... --- --- --- --- --- Some of the following is based on conversations with people on various game development sites over many years. The 'Player Created Assets' with a collaboration mechanism will be a big thing in these games someday (Second Life was a step in the right direction but actually discouraged collaboration with their pay model). Games are going to continue to cost more and more to produce, and if we don't tap into use of the largely free 'Players Imagination and Skills' to build the games, we will be stuck with a dwindling number of 'popular' subject genres and even fewer player interaction models (like WOW being the target that investors point to when it is actually a backslide/degeneration from games like Ultima Online and Asheron's Call). The idea of the Mini-Games being part of the Main Game likewise can tap into all the time that Players CANNOT be on their gaming machines at home. Because of the miracles of modern technology, we have these new connected devices powerful enough to run some gaming that WAS ONCE as powerful as their game computers only a few years ago. The increased 'AI' component and content Auto_Generation are 'subjects' I've pushed in various Game Developer forums. Unfortunately, these idea are not yet proven as a working model, and it will take a very daring company to do a big (expensive and risk) project using them. But once proven, with the advantages made obvious, they will likely be adopted quickly by the rest of the game industry simply to compete * Higher effectiveness of producing games via reuse of logic, assets, tools, player skills, * More interesting/complex/longer games.for less expense, * Player_Created_Assets allowing smaller niche games tapping into more genres (lowered cost to produce sufficient game content) --- --- --- It Takes a 'Village'/Community of Expertise ''': Unfortunately, one person cannot make a game like this (It is funny, in the Game Developer forums, when they have to 'read The Riot Act' to new/naive game programmers who say : "I want to make a MMORPG". The newbies are then enlightened about all that is involved (complexities) - They even have it in there FAQ, because over the years so many have said ignorantly presumed). The content in this Wiki are just a few of the design ideas involved with making a better MMORPG. ITS A Wall of Text ?? You should see how much it would take to actually explain technical details of how it would work. Here it is hopefully enough to demonstrate that there would be ENOUGH of a game in (for example) a Main_PageBioShock MMORPG to be 'worth it' to some game company ($$$) AND to the Players to make one like what is described. As I've mentioned somewhere, the Tools and system of processes they would develop for one game could be re-used for a dozen other games in other desirable genres (now can reach a wider spectrum of customers). - Unfortunately, it is a '''HUGE jump of faith by even the largest Commercial Game Companies (the Tool development will be is at least half such a Project's effort -- A task (and cost) equivalent to creating a whole game by itself - around $100 million these days. Most companies STILL couldn't manage to do such a Project with any competency even if they were funded). If someone goes to the investors and says : We want to spend twice as much money (or more) on creating Something we don't know will work, and What we've never done before --- What do you think the answer will be ???? A large company would have to decide they would do the required Tool building as a primary business strategy - intended as a basis for ALL the games they will do in the next 10 years, and use the leverage of more efficient game production (even if it does not have my ALL MY proposed Player Asset Creation feature in a MMORPG type Project). --- --- --- Need Good Programmers (Build the System and They Will Come) : A Templates system (and the advanced Game Mechanics it would be used with, in this MMORPG game) is NOT easy to create (That is : One that works, and does what is required, is easy to utilize, and is largely bug proofed --- AND ONE ABLE TO BE UNDERSTOOD AND USED BY NON-COMPANY PROGRAMMERS). Many times on previously produced MMORPGs, you have "Fixes" (game patches) which frequently Break more than they Fix because they have only Third String™ programmers left who remain/get-hired years after the initial production was released. Those employees also inherit the atrocious code of the "First String" (original) programmers and designers - Which the company's Management is afraid to fix properly, because of the expense (things which really should have been done properly at the very start). Also inherited are : patches ontop of patches to 'band-aid' fix problems instead of correcting them systematically (which with complex game mechanics, this means it gets more and more absurdly difficult to fix even the simplest issues). At some point, the game company is ALSO scared to change anything significantly lest they create more problems/bugs (which makes them look real bad competency-wise when they flub a Patch - An oft occurring thing), and those further problems also have to THEN be fixed (when there's already little budget allocated to programming). Frequently, those undetected/unfixed Patch problems go 'online' in the game, and cause the Players much distress -- All because the company has no real budget for proper testing/fixing (which, BTW, you are SUPPOSED to do BEFORE it is put out for the customers to find so many bugs). --- --- --- SO this is a Situation the Rapture Reborn MMORPG needs to Avoid : How do you prevent the above oft seen problems ?? ' Unfortunately the business model (to afford building the Game Engine and the Tools needed for this new way of doing things) means that the Assets for the initial game will start out rudimentary, and would be expected to grow through participation of the Players Creativity and Ability. Much would be added/revised over time (many things requiring added Game Engine features - which requires, at a minimum, modifications of the low level program code). Requirements : * A Good Process for all of this development mechanism (and sufficient of the required Tools). * A good Communication system to efficiently expose the found bugs and problems soonest - to make them available to the people with the skills able to correct them. * Better organized Testing -- Some games botch their Patches so badly, you wonder if they did ANY testing. So bad that often the problems are found by the Players INSTANTLY while playing and making use of those allegedly 'fixed' basic features. (A Game Company's HOPE usually lets the Players down). * Have Test Servers which run the candidate 'patched' code in the same manner as actually used Online/Live (with sufficient Test Tools built into them to facilitate proper/efficient testing). This would be required to happen LONG before any new code goes 'Live'. There would be Local Test Servers which run on a Player's own machine to allow them (and others) to PRETEST a great deal of their candidate code (the programmer's own and to do a check of others proposed code). Early testing like this is very useful for the Collaboration which much of this MMORPG's development depends on. * More than a little work is to be done by Users who can review/inspect/peruse the code/fixes, and who often have magnitudes more Skill (and often Time) than the typical game company's programmers at identifying/spotting/proving problems (and they CAN do it for free). "The EGO of one Player can be equal to and outdo the mediocre skill of a dozen company-paid programmers" - Sergeant Reality * A GOOD Design Process - minimize wasted time/effort undoing/scrapping something that wasn't right in the first place ("Measure Twice - Cut Once"). Final decision is with the company authority who sets the direction and arbitrates, but a good Process can streamline that work. * Good Documentation Process (it is part of the communications needed to make a Project like a MMORPG work effectively). This includes well-defined Standards which can be pointed at to eliminate/reduce contention (again so as TO NOT WASTE TIME). Truth - Most Programmers are simply NOT interested (and frequently not capable) of documentation of this type. * 'Creator' Player programmers who will originate ALOT of the new code (generating New Game Mechanics to support proposed new game features/improvements). Again there are many out there who have vast expertise which would be tapped into. Changes to the Game Mechanics of the MMORPG are more restricted/controlled (being fundamental building blocks for everything) than the next layer up - which is the Template functionality and other 'scripting' Assets. (The Tools required will likewise largely be the product of these gifted people). * Have lots of Test Rigging functionality built INTO the Game Engine and Tools to assist with and facilitate PROPER testing as much as possible. * Have Peer Review and Testing as early as possible (and access to a community of qualified Programmers/Testers 100X as large as any company might have). * Templates using that Game Engine code would have, by design, Automatic Test Rig functionality built into THEM to assist in quickly finding obvious problems (and to give a legup finding and reporting harder/more elusive bugs). --- --- --- '''What's GENERALLY Hard to Do Making A MMORPG Computer Game ' : * Adaquate Challenge when the Player wants it (in MMORPG there is also times they DONT want it) * Offering Choices - without having too many become 'easiest' and allowing Player to quickly get in a rut * Sufficient new experiences * Making a Game feel fun to Play (continually its a MMORPG which is meant to be played for years) * Keeping the Game balanced and interesting (not repetitiously boring) * Making all the Art Assets correctly (no bugs, consistency of detail) * Properly Animating any/all Cutscenes (story flashbacks...) * Setting up the Pacing correctly (cutscene/canned content vs gameplay vs Story 'Talk') * Ensuring the Voice Acting matches the animation * Setting up lots of Side Quests/Missions (Player options) that are bug free (this is VERY hard when they are interactionally complicated) * For MMORPGs - Don't contradict the Main Story (i.e. you can't be acting all Superman against an optional boss, reviving a forgettable character in a Side Mission; and then the Main Story treats you like you're just a regular mortal, and tosses in the Perma-Death of a main character). And many more details that make a game feel like an AAA game. --- --- --- 'Difficulties for Any Game Company attempting to Create this (Illuminated on this WIKI) kind of 'Advanced' MMORPG ': * Creating the Modular systems which defines every bit of the Game (done systematically from the very start) : **Has to be done thoroughly with completeness and understanding of all that the Game will encompass. Because making '''major changes later will disrupt/waste alot of existing work/effort/resources and require alot of rework. " Measure Twice, Cut Once " ... Games have to make money and the project is daunting enough WITHOUT cost overruns killing it. * Tool Creation - alot of effort is needed to make the Player Creation Tools 'consumer grade' : ** Developers can be trained as part of their job, but most Players will want/need a shallow learning curve, and will lose interest if it takes too long just to create something simple. ** Player users should not have to 'Fight the Tools' when trying to get something done. Frustration levels need to be kept very low. ** WYSISYG of course (What You See Is What You Get - as much as possible) ** The many Tools required will have to overlap/interact, and have to be well integrated to facilitate 'ease of use' for creating Assets that have many different component parts/aspects. Simple Assets often go thru half a dozen different Tools (include the submission process). * Plugin (for Tools) able to be created/developed by Players. This should be facilitated (by simplifying additional USEFUL game tool additions -- again - The Players skills/knowhow/genius to create/improve Tools can greatly exceed the company's ability and needs to be tapped into). * The huge Asset Creation Community - managing it, guiding it, resolving 'people' problems : ** Managing NEW Canon and Lore (decisions for things never define by the previous Games or the Novel) Cohesion and Consistency IS needed. ** Planning for a coherent expansion of the Game World. This usually requires mapping out major World Map features (planned expansion) well ahead of time to guide the more detailed information being created later. ** Goading Players into creating/improving what is needed/missing/insufficient in the Game, and avoiding redundancy/over-coverage. Telling Player Creators that we have enough of 'X' and now need more of 'Y'. This includes the quality of Assets, not just quantity of types. ** Rewards to people for creating something shared by others (has to be more ego-oriented than mercenary). Proper credit given ... Most difficult Assets WILL take dedicated effort. ** Managing the shear amount of Game Content - the MMORPG would eventually have many times the content of the largest MMORPG worlds, both in numbers of Objects ('types' not endless clones filling Player's banks), but also in different/spectrum of new kinds/types (complex types not createable in other Games) and how they all interplay/interact/integrate. * Server Management - A whole additional dimension : Running massive Servers 24/7 and keeping them up and accessible to Players. Companies who never did 'it' before largely have NOT-A-CLUE what problems they would/WILL face, and then have to continually solve (and this MMORPG Project would greatly exceed what common MMORPGs do these days, so even THEY will be lacking in experience). * The manual Gamemaster tasks - how to adjust the game when things get unbalanced. Sufficient tools are required to make this work efficiently. Labor saving is ESSENTIAL to the Game's economic viability. * The cooperative Creation mechanism (like the MMORPG itself) would include a CONSTANT transfer of Data to the Player's Client machines to update new Assets, including recently modified Client-cached parts of the Game World map. Internet speeds are getting faster, and that extra capacity will probably be needed for a system like this one (MOST IMPORTANT FOR THE RUNNING GAME where Loading of data ahead-of-need is preferred, but Load that nearest crap quick will still be a stress on the games streaming data system). * Disk storage on the Client is a secondary problem. SDDs (Solid-State Disk Drives) are becoming more common/cheaper, and their GREATER speed/capacities keep going up. Conventional disks also are increasing capacity steadily (may need to employ a buffering system to move 'Ready' data to the SDD from a much bigger old-tech disk drive on the Client machine is potentially still far faster than trying to push the data through the Internet real-time.) --- --- --- "Consoles May Be Problematic" : Computer Memory may be the biggest limitation with the planned increase in World Complexity -- even just what is visible in the Players immediate vicinity will be significantly more than current games, and handling crunch/rush situations where excessive Player/Objects are in view is desirable. Console compatibility - ? Second-Class status for Consoles gameplay ?? (perhaps that industry will make more flexible hardware upgrading possible - but that CANNOT be counted upon). * Consoles freeze their abilities/capacities for many years at a time. Dumbing-down the MMORPG Game's Client to fit no-longer-new console hardware is a problem. Console user-base is considerable and it would be a shame to not include that many potential Players. * More than a few of the game advancements make use of Client-side processing and disk resources (Older Consoles (at that time) may NOT have the capacity of CPU that gaming PCs will have available). * Upgrade issue - Insufficient resources/capabilities on older consoles ( many people would not be wanting to upgrade, but it might require whatever the latest generation might have -- inevitably by the time a Game like this might come out, even with competent resources behind the MMORPG's development it would be years). * Disk resident Asset Dictionary is important for World detail resolution - the old-school 'baked'terrain/occupants (pre-canned 'Level' system) having been replaced with more Dynamic On-The-Fly mechanism in the MMORPG Client. Even if Consoles have large disks, can they transfer/load the needed Data fast enough (disk controller speed issue ...) ??? * Methods of 'simplifying' the data for less capable Client machines (including Consoles)?? How much can you lose before the game gets too sucky ?? How much detail could you 'cut-on-the-fly' before most of the game's advances are gone ? * Console Interface Limitations - just too limited/clumsy for all the things/actions/commands the PC-based Player will be able to do (new mechanisms like Voice Recognition can only do so much, or aren't available) ? --- --- --- Assets Level Of Detail (Variable Adjustments) for Adapting to Different 'Target' Computer Hardware Caps ': * Simplified Textures and Simplified Meshes (and animations) at lower settings. * Animated/Texture view focus limitation (one/fewer at a time) * Simpler Lighting Effects * Level Of Detail (LOD) adjusted for different settings (lowered/simplified details increasing with distance pro-rated for Graphics 'Setting') * Visibility limiting Terrain (ie-View Blocking Walls) used to 'cut' non-visible renderings (including through 'Portals') * Sounds from nearby are played, further away sounds only if loud or significant. --- --- --- 'MMORPG - Shifting The CONCEPT Of Players 'Winning' ''' : Defeating (or facing off) a single foe (or group as large as your own) without casualties is a significant victory. There need not be 'body counts' (as is usually chronic in so many unimaginative games) which would, if realistic, soon choke the Ocean/the-Halls with corpses. The effort involved to create this adjusted game-style would be far greater than required for the usual Pop-A-Mole generic opponents many games have (like the bizarre/illogical 'minefields of enemies' seen populating so many MMORPGs). Opponents can/should run away ... Success can just be thwarting the designs of the particular opponent (who is up-to-no-good vis New Rapture's future). Indirect benefits of 'success' : * (*** Add a 'Whining Splicer Captive' Asset to the game ... ***) * You get to hear a story or some 'Intel' which might lead-in to other interesting things (indirect loot/advancements) * A record of your activity is permanent - a 'dossier' of the opponent * 'Progress' Measurement Indicators (for you and others to see) * How your 'team talks (and comments from NPCs) mentioning your exploits ... * Mention in the New Rapture Tribune (or equivalent) --- --- --- '''Improving Player Intractability : There can be a Problem with not having enough Players being 'ON' at the same real world time. Are there enough Players around to interact with ? (AND Not busy doing other game activities even when then playing.) How many 'direct' interactions (or indirect) have to be facilitated to fill-in sufficiently for the kind of 'social' aspects this MMORPG is trying to achieve ? --- --- --- For A MMORPG Game with More Complex Interactions : Playing MMORPGs has an Internet network turnaround delay, so cannot be 'twitch' type interactions (chiefly of combat ). Enemies should generally 'telegraph' their actions to give Player a chance to action a countermove (Brandishing their weapon, Yelling stuff like "Ahm Gonna Toast Yo Azz, Skumbaag!!", Charging up a Plasmid, etc ...) Particularly in a game where the NPCs have a wide range of actions and tactics (affects on the Player are more complicated than simply having a one dimensional Bullet-Sponge damage system.) The Player has to be given the chance to observe what is happening next, and then time to work the interaction interface (which often is a bit more than a 'Fire' trigger). Likewise maneuvering to cover or to access terrain features. - No One-Shot-Kill (or disablement) type actions (have to give Player a chance to figure out what happened and decide on countermeasures). Likewise loophole against NPCs is too easy. Escalations of damage inhibiting actions, forcing more alternatives to be used. --- --- --- Issues with Clipping Edges (Basic Game Mechanics for Terrain Movement) : Often they were very sloppy in BS1/BS2, with clear line of sight shot, but with the shot resulting in hitting an edge that wasn't even close to being in the way (visually). Better game mechanics, with more precise Bounding Boxes and such are needed to prevent 'WTF' moments for Players when there is a discrepancy in what they see versus what the game mishandles. Particularly annoying are situation where your fire clips the wall incorrectly, but the same target enemy can hit you back just fine (and does). There is really no excuse for such annoyances existing in games. The MMORPG with some more complicated terrains would need its engine not to have such lame problems. --- --- --- LET THERE BE ROLEPLAYING !!! : Latest Levine 'Gratest Thing Evah' (circa 2017) Levine (Talking about game ideas for 'Ghost Story Games' coming game) : "One of the most important things about what we're doing now is this concept of Radical Recognition ... that if the player does something, the game should - as often as we can - recognize that accomplishment, or failure, or whatever it is, and find ways to have the world feed back that it cares ... The heart of that is something that’s central to our game." * NPCs react to your actions (instead of tree plot) - assume modify your missions. * I Assume its a game you keep going BACK to the same set of NPCs (and/or have sidekicks ?) to be ABLE to get changed reactions from them. * "the player can learn, act upon, and affect a non-linear narrative story," * Supposedly the game wont be as 'explainy' about why people react to you (and/or howthe game works)and you have to figure it out yourself * Consider that ALOT of specialized content is needed, or the game will be too small to have much playthrough/replayability, or have too much repetition (and LOTS of content is a big budget problem). (( '' Consider though the similar big claims about Infinite BS which were never realized ... '' )) - Ambient Coments on the Interwebz : * "In a world where we've been sold lies over and over regarding videogames, these devs need to be more realistic and less vague. When the game is revealed and previewed, I'll believe some of these claims." * "He's great at piling on loads of bullshit onto his games, but no real substance. Just another advertising shill loaded with buzzwords and no workable ideas." * "I dont know.. after bioshock infinite I dont quite trust this guy anymore" - Levine mentions the idea used in ' "Shadow of Mordor's Nemesis System" '. THAT is described as a combat opponent generating system with factions, classes and experience ramps, and lots of weapon/skill/appearance/tactics(?) options to randomize (and some persistence to the individuals to allow them to mutate as the game moves forward). A NPC social system with a greater player activity scope than just 'combat interactions' will be far more complex (perhaps combat is still all this new game is mostly to be ????) Such a problem being Magnitudes more complex is the issue of how well Levine will be able to employ such a system. - Player Comment (About Meaningful NPCs) : "Levines's full of shit. He spent months hyping up Elizabeth's role in Infinite, before downsizing her strictly to support, and barely that. Hell, he didn't even have the stones to fight for her inclusion on the damn cover of the game. Worse yet, he tried to feed us that tired line of wanting to give the game its best chance. Bunk. " --- --- --- One thing to Fix - Crude Collision Boxes (in 3D Game Programming ): A "Collision Box" is the 3D area around an Object the computer uses to check if you hit it while moving, or for a projectile strike. Unfortunately for odd shaped object the 'collision box' can stick way out from the actual objects 3D surface (box refers to a simple boxy shape used to simplify the constantly done calculations in the game) and cause false-collision when they shouldn't happen. I saw a number of occasions in the Solo games where this was so. With better programming you can still use the simple box method, but then if you GET a collision with 'that box' you THEN further test with a much finer quality collision map of the Object so to get a truer collision calculation and truer game simulation. Consider when you Fire a projectile in a game with complex terrain and ALOT of independently movable objects that there is ALOT of calculations to perform. This goes for all Movement of Objects as will. --- --- --- MMORPG Naughty Word Filter (mode) : A possibility as so many/most new Assets will be text based instead of voice actoring (and text checking can be automated as part of the toolset to mark filterable words). Might even get the original voice actor content to be reedited to bleep the words (a project for Player Creators to identify them and/or edit as an alternate asset set). DECIDING WHAT IS AND ISNT ALLOWED IN-GAME - is a separate issue. In-game Player language is a bit more complicated - text can be filtered, as in other MMORPGs (optionally in this game). But ad hoc voice communications (unsolicited 'phone calls'/ face to face voice ??) are harder to police (requiring well spelled out EULA policies about such content). Mass transmitted voice (Radio/TV) would likely be pre-reorded and thus could be vetted (including rewards for reporting and penalties for those breaking/abusing the policies). Party/Group communication voice party-lines have separate rules, since those associations are voluntary. PRE-VETTING OF everything Player Created gets the same treatment and further manual scrutiny. --- --- --- Game With How Many Players ? : A Problematic Issue : Exactly how many Players (population) can there be in each game World (Server) ?? Estimate Rapture's 20k-40k population at its height, and now having shrunk to far less by 1970 after the Chaos (and Lambtopia) caused a major population decrease. It would be well under that high number. How many Players do you allow when there are ALSO supposed to be numerous (far more) 'wild' Splicers out there to serve as Opponents? (That is, even with a lower-body-count style combat to keep that population up and from being wiped out after a few days after the Game Goes Live ...). You could have Servers with only 1000 Players each on them. BUT Is that enough for constant meaningful interactions with other Players (Even just to be seen, the way Players (playtimes) spread out over timezones - just have different playing hours)?? Part of the game is seeing what other Players are upto (the creativity element massively enabled) and have built. With such a small (1000 Player ) Server population, it might make that far less workable/effective that having ALL the games Players crowded onto One Big World Server. If a BIG population, then having shops, residences and such likewise can get strange for the 'New Rapture' -- if they are too numerous for the story situation. Ways of 'plausibly' increasing Rapture game time population : * NPC Team are temporary 'hires' (or moonlight) - this allows reuse (can be more nebulous in the numbers interacting with Players). * Ex-Splicers who keep 'Goin off the Wagon' (recycling personalities out into the Splicer environment) * Force-multipliers of 'Bots' assisting the Player (less humans but still bulking up 'expeditions') * Splicers been breedin' (just more of them have Survived, and even 'flourished') and away from Sofia Lamb's recent tyrrany non-splicing normals have restored/maintained a modicum of civilization enough to have families. * Non-Splicer(human) enemies/interactors (Who didn't "die off" as much as Splicers might) -- My longterm 'take' is that there were whole areas of Rapture preserved from the depredations of evil wankers like Atlas and Lamb. * Outsiders - People have come in from outside of Rapture to populate some of the Missions. This would have to be carefully controlled in-story. * Less FATAL combat keeps replacement justification lower (instead of the whole place filling up with unlimmited enemy corpses -- the way that most MMORPGs have their 'bodycounts' in their combat) . * Those Vita Chambers did actually work (frequently). * Sorry, no 'multiple dimensions' Raptures which players can wander between. --- --- --- --- --- . .